Federal return rejection Reject Code F8960-019-04 Processing error Form 8960, Net Investment Income Tax. We do not have an estimate for when the problem will be resolved

[touchdown22]

Great suggestion.  Turbo Tax, are you listening??????

[janny27]

Furious!  I want MY money and fixing the glitch end of Feb-Mar is unacceptable :(

[pdlink300]

So glad this issue is known about and common.  Been banging my head against a wall all morning trying to figure out why the heck TT was including form 8960 in the first place. 

Bottom line, the IRS screwed the pooch with their automatic accept/reject system, and we are all wasting our time trying to fix it within TT.  The fact that form 8960 was even included in my return is abjectly ridiculous. I have no investment income, and somehow the system keeps putting self employment income in 8960 box 4a, and then the negative of box 4a in box 4b.

TT should be updated to recognize this situation and simply not include form 8960.  I pay $$$ to TT so I don't have to deal with this nonsense.  Get on this TT or you're going to lose me as a customer.

[BligBlueLaser]

@janny27 

Don't misunderstand - I'm in the same boat so I totally sympathize!!!

But if TurboTax is creating correct returns and it is an IRS-only issue that is causing the erroneous rejections (TBD), who do you want money back from?

[RKR2]

Any update if your return was approved or rejected?  My rejections via TurboTax came within an hour or so. 

[BligBlueLaser]

---

@pdlink300 wrote:

TT should be updated to recognize this situation and simply not include form 8960.  I pay $$$ to TT so I don't have to deal with this nonsense.  Get on this TT or you're going to lose me as a customer.

---

Except that the IRS updated Form 8960 instructions to say that you must include these amounts if you are required to file Form 8960.

Do you meet the MAGI requirements for filing found on page 1 of the IRS instructions? If yes, I suppose TT could allow you to just delete the form but that wouldn't be correct.

From that PDF:

Who Must File - Attach Form 8960 to your return if your modified adjusted gross income (MAGI) is greater than the applicable threshold amount.

[...]

The applicable threshold amount is based on your filing status.
• Married Filing Jointly or Qualifying Widow(er) is $250,000.
• Married Filing Separately is $125,000.

• Single or Head of Household is $200,000.

If you don't meet any of those thresholds, then yeah TT needs to fix something.

[brian-dolan]

Do you know if this is an issue with IRS and Turbotax or does it affect all tax software company's?  Meaning can we file with HRBlock, TaxAct or other?  

[BligBlueLaser]

@brian-dolan 

Summarizing what we know from replies above (since TT is giving near-zero guidance):

Some folks have successfully e-filed with H&R Block, but we haven't heard back as to whether their returns were accepted (and refunds scheduled).

• One or two people (maybe more?) said their returns on HRB did not include Form 8960, which is OK if the form is not required, and not OK if the form is required because they meet the MAGI thresholds outlined in the IRS's instructions
• Another person ( @Tim Jin ) filed with HRB but *did* have an 8960 included in their e-file - we're waiting to hear if their filing is accepted and refund scheduled

Tagging in the TT experts from the "Meet Your Experts" sidebar (who still don't seem to want to get involved):

@LindaS5247 

@JosephS1 

@MichaelG81 

@SantinoD 

@RalphH1 

[marytony]

I mentioned previously at the beginning of this post, the people that left tt and did file successfully on H&RB & on eTax were going to have the problem later on. Now they've filed and the delay will prob be worse than just waiting for the IRS to update the problem. I only believe this will happen to anyone that did in fact file and it was accepted because in 2021, I had a similar problem and had to wait MONTHS longer for my refund than everyone that was patient for the fix. I had to file an amended return and hire a Tax Advocate Service to help communicate with the IRS on my behalf because they have a direct line to them the average person isn't allowed to have. It was insane.

So bottom line, I think if you do in fact find a place to get your efile return accepted, you will have to file an amended return because the forms were incorrect. Just as BligBlueLaser stated above.  Amended returns have insanely long waits for refunds, as I can attest to.

The wait is so unfair to all of us, but the alternative is going to be worse. File now, wait longer later. OR PAPER FILE NOW, which none of us wants to do. 

Consider you paper file now and it's 6 weeks for a refund. That's March 18th.  The same time frame for the electronic fix, supposedly and so far at this time. Now what happens if your paper return gets to the IRS before the fix. The paper returns are supposedly handled manually, however ... question... does the irs agent INPUT your paper return into their own program and if so, that program will have the SAME INFORMATION and again, it's rejected or they ask for more time to handle the problem any way.

No matter how you file, if it's earlier than the fix, your may be making it even worse on yourself. 

The nicest thing would be for anyone who has received a refund to please come back and tell the rest of us. 

[Laz23]

Done with TT for good.

After paying the $100 or so for TT self employed I paid $120 for HR block and it was way better than TT.

First off TT would not let me E file STATE since I had more than 30 W2-G forms. So I printed it and they did not even include them in the print out. They said e-file for my state with more than 30 W2-G forms are dictated by the state but the state does not require them to be submitted. Anyway HR Block e-filed with no issues my 30+ W2-G forms.

As a long TT user I fell HR Block online is much better and more precise. And I did have a 8960 form in HR Block but the LET ME ENTER ZEROS in the fields (like the tax professionals say to fix this) unlike TT tax.

So time will tell if my returns are accepted.

[RKR2]

@kingmk888   You said your return was accepted via H&R Block last Wednesday.  Have you received any further communication regarding your refund? Now that the IRS has updated the proposed "fix" for form 8960 to end of February-late March, I'm contemplating re-doing my taxes on H&R Block today.

[pdlink300]

Makes sense and thanks - I was blowing off steam.  It's the IRS's problem and TT is creating returns correctly.

I still think TT should have some way of recognizing this prior to e-filing.  Perhaps preemptively tell users with this issue to wait until the IRS fixes their buggy accept/reject software before filing.  It could be part of the "checking your return for issues" feature.  That way we don't all waste our time and patience trying to track this down ourselves.

[denisep962]

I have been watching this discussion since I first attempted to file my return. I think I have decided to just wait even if it means waiting till March. Frankly, I do not want to pay for another service and run into the same problem.

1. The fact that some did not get the returns kicked back is not a guarantee that it worked. Until they have some coin in their jeans from the IRS, how can we know another service worked any better?
2. I can spend my whole refund trying to get this filed before the fix.
3. I am not waiting to pay off a bill or to buy groceries so although I am anxious to get the money, I can wait.
4. I don't want to risk trying to get it in earlier only to wait weeks or months longer than I would have waited had I just submitted it in March.

If someone gets bonafide success before March, I hope they let us know. Meanwhile, I will settle for delayed gratification. Really, it is inconvenient and disappointing but the only reason I am aware of this situation is that I filed a few weeks earlier than I normally have done in years past. Had I waited till March as I have done before, I probably would never have known this problem even existed. Will I use TurboTax again? Most likely. Crap happens. It's a pain but it happens. I worked in IT for most of my adult life and I teach online college courses. This is not the first time I have seen things with technology go awry and I am pretty sure it won't be the last. I will keep following this thread just to see if there are new developments. Meanwhile, I am going to make some tea, do some knitting, and cool my jets. ;-D

[Dan151]

Thanks to all the input on this thread.   I had the same nightmare with 8960.  I just have taxable interest from a savings account for line 1 and a non-passive business loss which is zeroed out in line 4c, but had my federal return  rejected within an hour or so on 2/3/23 with same error code.   The rejection also triggered a rejection on my Indiana return.   

Filing a paper return could be problematic if this is an IRS problem and might result in a delayed second rejection.  And, since my state return needs to follow a proper federal return, that too would be hung up. 

I am confident that TT and the IRS are aware of the issue and will wait for a resolution before going back in the pool.  Somehow the TT television commercials don't reflect an accurate picture of how difficult filing your taxes can be with them.   A recompense from TT would help maintain their credibility.

[BligBlueLaser]

@Laz23 

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE let us know what happens!