I have no penalty, but Turbotax filled out a form 2210, checked Box A and wrote in "85% waiver". I submitted the return, but it was rejected

[drrossba]

fhydeaz ....  Thanks so much for the explanation on the number (2) work-around!!   Since it was tax liability and not tax due, I was concerned that using that work around might mess up something else in the return.... However Federal has now accepted after 3 prior rejections.  (Turbotax Deluxe download on OSX  10.14.3)

[BobbyO]

My thinking is that those that implemented a work-around to trick TT to not file form 2210 should rerun your taxes after TT releases the proper fix. Keep that corrected rerun as your historical tax return. If you don't, you may run the risk of having improper historical data stored in the program for future years. Even though TT did not file a 2210 form for me last year, I could actually pull that form up in the 2017 program and see how the numbers worked-out so as not to file that form. With somewhat similar results this year, something is triggering the 85% Waiver calculation worksheet to be run even though the 90% of tax due was more than met (110%+) with timely estimated tax payments made. My experience is based on the MAC version...hope TT fixes both Windows AND MAC CD versions.

[fhydeaz]

Excellent suggestion, BobbyO. I will do this. I have some sympathy for the TT coders, who were faced with a massive overhaul as a result of the new tax law. Best wishes, everyone.

[anson]

Thanks for everyone's help!  I did the override to eliminate the X in box A on Part II of the 2210.  That caused form 2210 to be deleted from my file and also from the transmission to the IRS.  Was accepted in 25 minutes after 2 prior rejections.  Windows 10 Desktop version of TTax.  

[anson]

Thanks for everyone's help!  I did the override to eliminate the X in box A on Part II of the 2210.  That caused form 2210 to be deleted from my file and also from the transmission to the IRS.  Was accepted in 25 minutes after 2 prior rejections.  Windows 10 Desktop version of TTax.  

[bobfrye]

BobbyO, good suggestion. This is clearly an error in TurboTax.

[b-py]

Excellent work by the commenters on this question, particularly the work-arounds.  I see what TT did wrong, and it especially hits people like me who pay much of their taxes by estimated tax payments.  The official IRS instructions for Form 2210, Line 6 says to add the amount on Line 16 of Form 1040 (which is taxes withheld on a W-2 or 1099) plus the amount on Schedule 5 to the 1040 (which includes estimated tax payments).  TT forgot to include the Schedule 5 amount in their program's calculation of Line 6 of the Form 2210.  Consequently, if you are a big estimated tax payer, you get no credit for those payments in the TT program and get hit with the Form 2210.  So it is an easy fix to change the calculation of Line 6 of the Form 2210 to include the Schedule 5 amount (to the extent that anything in software is easy).  I expect that is what we will see in the promised March 1 update.

[b-py]

... and consequently a valid work-around would be to Override Line 6 of the Form 2210 in TT with the sum of Form 1040, Line 16 plus the sum on Schedule 5 to the 1040.  If this were done, the Form 2210 would probably go away.  I haven't tried this to see if the TT program allows it, as I am content to wait for TT's promised March 1 update.  In any event, it is a legit work-around because it is what the IRS's instructions tell you to do.

[b-py]

... but on further reflection, it looks like the IRS caused the problem.  The IRS says only to include Line 72 of Schedule 5 on Line 6 of Form 2210.  This prevents you from crediting estimated tax payments, and forces you to at least the Short Form of Form 2210, a nightmare.  TT seems to have programmed the incorrect calculation which the IRS says to do.  If Line 6 of Form 2210 allowed inclusion of estimated tax payments, there would be no problem.  But the IRS form explicitly says to exclude them.  This seems to be the crux of the problem.

[drrossba]

If you download the IRS instructions they lead you through a complex calculation which ends up by saying basically that if you paid estimated taxes on time and paid enough you don't submit the form.  That path is not currently in Turbotax, and presumably will be implemented by the upcoming fix, but basically gets spoofed by the workarounds.  Turbotax correctly handled form 2210 last year so it's kind of hard to see how tax changes are at issue.  Form 2210 is the IRS answer to punishing you for not being omniscient. since, clearly, you should pay estimated taxes of the proper amount, at the proper rate, and at the time you earned the income and should know all of your income sources a year in advance.  Of course this really only works for salaried people with no variable supplements.  If Turbotax didn't handle the complex cases like this, (it used to) there would be no need to subscribe to it.   

[fhydeaz]

I think b&py has nailed it as to the source of the problem: the wording on IRS form 2210 for line 6 is inconsistent with the official Instructions for the form. Maybe finding these kinds of inconsistencies is what the IRS workers would have been doing had they not been furloughed for weeks...

[drrossba]

fhydeaz ....  The exact same wording (on form 2210) was on last year's Turbotax form 2210  but last year Turbotax chose Box "C" as the rationale for the estimated tax payments and filled out the applicable section. That year I paid the estimated tax in installments but the impact was not "due" until the 4th quarter so part IV and Schedule AI were invoked and calculated no penalty.  I should note that it was 2016 Turbotax's vouchers that prodded me to pay over time.  This year the  program chose to use Box "A" instead for a nearly identical situation.  If you look at what the form does, it's intended to penalize people for underpaying withholding or estimated taxes or paying estimated taxes later than due (presumably depriving the treasury of at least the equivalent of interest).   It may be tempting to blame the furlough but I think historical evidence suggests "decisions" at Intuit.  The Box "A" path is certainly less complicated.

[b-py]

Gratis to drrossba and fhydeaz, but I now think the crux of the problem is how TT implemented the "85% Waiver" which is new this year.  Otherwise, the Form 2210 is the same as it was in 2017.  What TT should have done is invoke their 85% waiver worksheet only if the penalty calculations of Part III or Part IV show a penalty is due.  TT's program automatically did the Regular Method for me both last year and this year.  If no penalty is due from one of these Methods, then the 85% Waiver worksheet should be left blank, which will leave Box A blank, and there is no problem.  TT's mistake was filling in the 85% Waiver worksheet when it was not needed, which triggers the X in Box A.  You can fix TT's mistake by overriding the X in either the worksheet box or Box A.  Commenter inventor27798 nailed this five days ago in his/her comment in the string.

[wangfang123]

I have the same issue. Rejected twice and TT rep said I have to mail my return. Very frustrated

[Tony__T]

TurboTax fix moved out (again), now;  "scheduled to be fixed in an update that is currently planned to be released on 3/8/2019."
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