I live and work in Florida for a NY based company. My company took out nearly $1600 from my income for NY State Taxes. How do I get a refund?

[mohitnow]

I live in Miami in  job based out of NY. My employer withholds full NY taxes as i started the job in NY and then moved to Miami at the start of the pandemic.

2 days a week I work from home. 3 days a week I work in the field  or from the Miami office. 2 months a year I am on vacation. Do i understand that for the 3 days worked in the field/Miami office plus 2 months of vacation time I can get a tax refund from NY?

Thank you in advance.

[Hal_Al]

@mohitnow 

Q. Do i understand that for the 3 days worked in the field/Miami office plus 2 months of vacation time I can get a tax refund from NY?

A.  No. It's all or nothing.  See the convenience of the employer discussion, above, in this thread.

"moved to Miami at the start of the pandemic" sounds like you moved for you own convenience.  But, "3 days a week I work in the field  or from the Miami office" sounds like you moved for the convenience of the employer.

If the work you do in FL could not have been done in NY, then you are in FL for the convenience of the employer and none of your FL work income is taxable by NY.

[croka]

I moved out of my convenience from NYC to Miami end of September last year, while working for a NY-based employer. I do not own an abode in NYC and I did not intend to come back (never had). While filing taxes for this year with Turbotax, it found me liable to 100% taxes withheld by the state, which is understandable.

However, it also found me liable to 100% taxes withheld by the city, which, to my understanding, is wrong. Moreover, in the "New York City and Yonkers Information" section, in "Part-year city additional allocations and info", I cannot edit the "New York City Resident Portion", which equals to Federal Amount. 

I already e-filed, but only realized this now. Am I eligible to a tax credit? If so, why won't Turbotax allow me to edit the amount for NYC only?

[DanielV01]

It sounds like you will be due a refund via an amended return, @croka.  Based on the facts you present, and presuming that you were teleworking for a NY-based employer once you moved to Florida, your income was taxable to New York State (part-year as a resident and part-year nonresident).  But for NYC, you would only be liable for tax for the portion of the year in which you were physically residing in NYC, as New York City does not tax nonresidents.

I can't see your tax return, but I do suspect you may have filled out the wrong form for New York, which may have caused the experience you had.  Check your New York State paperwork to see if you filed a New York resident return (Form IT-201).  Because you moved during the year, you should have been using New York's Part-Year/Nonresident return (Form IT-203).  If you were inside of the New York resident return, it would explain why the NYC/Yonkers information may have been greyed out.  With a nonresident return, (which would have allowed you to define your New York state residency), you would have defined your NYC residency as well, and would not have paid NYC tax for the nonresident period.

The following Help Article will assist you to prepare and file a New York State Amended Return:  I need to amend my state return (click on link). If you take those steps and still are not able to amend the return, call into customer support for additional assistance and ensure there's not a technical issue that is preventing you from making the desired change.

[Devans926]

My wife's NYC company has been remote all throughout the pandemic and recently completely got rid of their office space in NYC. There is literally no option for her to go to a physical office. If we relocated to another state, say Florida, what would be our Tax obligations to NYC or NY State?

[DanielV01]

@Devans926  It depends.  On the surface it would appear that at the very least you would not have an obligation to NYC, as I stated above, if you move away from New York City.  And you would think that you would not have an obligation to New York State, either, but it is not quite that simple.  First and foremost, to potentially have zero liability to New York City/State, you do have to completely move from the City/State.  Both will continue to consider you what is called a "statutory resident"  of the city/state if you:

• Maintain an abode.  This would be a house, an apartment, etc.  An abode is not a school dorm, a hotel (even long-term), etc.
• Have a physical presence in New York for 184 days or more.  Be careful with telework, because New York is aggressive in tax enforcement in this area.  If you are maintaining an abode in New York, the state (and city) may well consider telework in the state a physical presence to qualify you as a statutory resident that would (potentially) allow them to tax all of your income regardless of where you earn it.  (I am not 100% familiar with New York's stance on this last point, but I do know they aggressively enforce their telework "convenience" principle very, very aggressively, so being prepared to deal with this possibility would be wise).

Of course, if you move to Florida, and your wife's job has moved outside of New York City or state, the point is moot.  You can't be a statutory resident of the city/state if you are not physically present at least 184 days, even if you are maintaining an abode.  And if you are not maintaining an abode in New York, you are not a resident there even if you are physically present all 365 days of the year.

But be careful to assume that because the company does not currently have a physical office in New York City that they are not NYC-based and operated.  There is a physical location attached to the business, and if that physical location is NYC, relief from tax liability is not automatic, as I mention above.  It gets muddy, because (and the company may have done this intentionally) New York's convenience law in essence states that they can tax the teleworker because the job they are doing remotely isn't because they can't do it at the NY office, but rather because it is a convenience to work remotely.  But if there's no physical office, there's an argument that it's not a convenience to work remotely, but a necessity.  I just can't guarantee that New York will buy the argument, however.

Bottom line is that the easiest way to receive relief from New York City liability is to actually move and sell or relinquish control of any NYC-property that can be defined as an "abode" that you might maintain.  Then, verify with the company to find out where there official "location"  actually is, document everything, and be prepared to answer questions from the city/state should such arise.  

[fareedm]

Hi DanielV01, 

I worked for a consulting firm in 2021 where my office was based out of NYC.  In June 2021, I bought a primary residences in Miami, Florida and moved here. The official office changed took place in October 2021. Would I be able to do allocation to get back my NYC state taxes from June to October where I worked in Florida? Technically, I was working from home and like most people, everyone was working remotely. 

Thanks for all your help. 

Best,

[Anonymous_]

You might want to read through the New York State Department of Taxation and Finance publication (link below).

https://www.tax.ny.gov/pdf/memos/income/m06_5i.pdf

@fareedm 

[DanielV01]

Probably not.  The instructions to the allocation form Form IT-203-B Nonresident and Part-Year Resident Income Allocation Form (click on link to open up form) requires that "at-home" work days be excluded from days allocated outside of New York.  If you see line 1j on the form, this is specifically mentioned.  As @Anonymous_ presents with that article, for a day working from home to be considered as not taxable to New York, New York generally considers that such work must be necessary to perform from an out-of-state employee, and not just a convenience to do so.  Living over 1000 miles away in Miami does not make working from home necessary by New York's standards.  Being required to be in Miami to physically attend to client interests could be.  

Based on this, it is unlikely that New York will accept allocating your at-home work from June to October as income not subject to New York tax.  Even if you moved, you will still be liable to pay tax on this income as a nonresident.

But you are correct that once you set up a Miami-based office (not at home), this now meets New York's definition of necessary, so going forward, you do not pay New York tax on that income.

@fareedm 

[pabreu08]

I recently relocated from NYC to Florida and NY job confirmed that I will need to pay state taxes due to "convenience of the employer rule". My question now is, I will only be going back to NY for work for roughly 5-10 days for the entire 2022 calendar year. Will I be able to submit IT form come tax season in 2023 to claim some funds as a refund?

[DanielV01]

It's likely you can.  You might find some of the insights provided by @kristinelby helpful in the following thread that discusses this subject (and you will notice the references to statute and case law):  Click Here

Based on the education I received on New York's convenience statute, there are at least three conditions that New York must be able to prove before applying convenience:

1. You must be working both "within" and "without" New York State (both inside and outside of the state, and not exclusively remotely from outside of the state).
2. You do not have, per New York's definition, a legitimate home office that creates "necessity" of working from home
3. Work within New York is not "de minimis"

In the conversation, NY courts have established that 25% physical presence in New York is not de minimis.  How much presence would be considered de minimis is a good question, because statute does not make it clear.  However, it is more likely than not that 5 days in the year is still a de minimis presence.  Those 5 days are still taxable to New York, but may not break the threshhold of "de minimis" presence in New York for the state to apply convenience.  The answer I refer to above does provide ways to substantiate any claim for 2022 (in 2023) regarding this.

And there is also a way to establish that you have a bona fide home office.  Please note New York's instructions in this link: (Click on blue link to open document, and scroll down to the subheading of the same name)  Factors to apply to determine if a home office is a bona fide employer office.  

@pabreu08

[Anonymous]

@DanielV01

I have a somewhat comparable situation, so I figured I'd ask here before making my own post. I work for a company that is based in Brooklyn, but we have employees/warehouses in FL (where I also lived by coincidence). I started working there starting in 2020 (remotely) and I was listed as a FL employee and had my W2 listed as such (worked for about 3 months until the end of the year). I was for sure listed as a FL employee. I started 2021 still working in FL but moved on Jun 1 to NYC. We use a third-party HR company, and I made sure to square away my state change (since I was not being taxed any NYC taxes previously). This also allowed me to get health insurance there, etc. The W2 doesn't show a separate line for FL income, only NY and it shows the full salary amount for NY. I asked to get a new W2 (W2-c) and I realized that my employer listed my move as Jun 21 (just fixed today to reflect Jun 1). So I know for their records, I was switched from FL to NY during the year. 

How should my W2 look? Should there be any acknowledgement of FL on there?

Also, I see from your previous comment that I should fill out the Form IT-203 (Part Year Resident Tax Return) and Form IT-360.1 (Change of City Resident Status).  If there would not be anything that shows Forida (since there's no state income tax), how would I go about seaprating what part of my tax bill is from FL and which is from NY? 

[ZoltanB45]

The IT 203 lists the federal income and the NY State amount.  There are no questions about where the other income is being attributed to. Rather than how much is being allocated to Florida and New York, you would be asked to list the total federal income and the income attributed to NY. The fact that there is no Florida tax return, is irrelevant.

It seems like the employer may have treated your W-2 as if you lived in NY the whole time, and only worked in Florida part of the year. If that was the case NY would tax you on all the income earned and then credit you for the taxes paid in other state. This would not be accurate. In your situation, the W-2 state income needs to be split accurately.

[DanielV01]

@Anonymous  New York requires a New York employer to report all income to New York State (and New York City, as applicable) on the W2.  Because of convenience of the employer (taxation of remote workers), New York companies are not allowed to assume that income earned both inside and from outside of New York state is not taxable to New York.  That's left up to the taxpayer to do through Allocation.  

You will file a part-year return to New York.  Your remote income earned in Florida (when you had no physical connection to working for the company in New York), is not taxable to New York,  In the New York return, you will use the allocation screens to designate the portion of income that was earned physically in New York (and, presumably, after moving to New York), and the portion of income that was effectively Florida income.  It will be very important to maintain documentation of your move (which it sounds like you have done), because New York could try to contest that your "Florida" income is "New York" income.  But it isn't, provided that you were a part-year Florida resident, and prior to moving to New York, you did not provide any services physically within New York State.  (New York City would be moot.  A NYC nonresident is not taxed in NYC).

Please see the consideration of this by kristinelbly's comments in this thread here.  It's a bit of material, but she provides excellent background and ways to prove that your income prior to becoming a New York resident would not be taxable to New York (unless you had a physical connection to that work also).

[Blitz121221]

Hi,

Here is a good one. I moved from upstate NY to FL (Sept. 2021) for my wife's much higher paying job that requires us to live in our new area where she can visit her local practices in Florida east/west coast via driving (we have supporting evidence of all above). Sold every NY asset we had before moving. I put my 5 week notice in for my NY job before we left. They could not find a suitable replacement then offered me to work remote full time so I did not leave the company. It seems convenient for my employer - and we have all supporting evidence of that situation. I have three questions that have some contingencies:

1) Am I liable for NYS taxes next year 2022? 

2) Is my employer required to pay 1/2 NYS income tax & pay unemployment insurance for me?

3) If yes to both above - and I am let go - would NYS allow me unemployment benefits? Or just "disassociate me" and write me off because I moved to Florida?