Turbo Tax 2020 not adding Form 2210 for underpayment penalty

[Spino]

@DawnC Please check my posts about the calculation error on form 2210, in situations where people have an overpayment in the first/second quarter. At least a few of these people are being impacted by this error.

[Spino]

@AmirK Check my posts on this topic, as it appears you may be affected by this error.

Also, note that 2210 is NOT filed even though you owe a penalty unless you fit one of the exceptions or want to supply additional information. This is intended, I believe, to lower your paperwork.

However, since TT is WRONGLY calculating the penalty in some situations due to the error I have identified, this error will show up on your return even when 2210 is not included in your return. :-(. 

My guess is that TT will get this corrected within a week or two. Ultimately no one should end up being charged a penalty incorrectly since the IRS checks this, unless of course the mistake is the IRS's rather than TT's.

[bhtn75]

Thanks, I spent 2 hours on the phone with TT support yesterday and they seemed to be unaware of this problem. They  uploaded a diagnostic copy of my Form 2210 Part IV and created a case number. We'll see what happens. 

I've used TT since the mid 1980's, but this is the first time I've ever come across a coding error in TT.

[Spino]

It happens. If you mark my answer as a best answer, it will help others find it....

Note that this form just came online and that it is awkward this year because a column is missing. Somewhere in those weeds was no doubt the genesis for this particular problem.
I once had the IRS reject my return because they error-checked the annual amount on the 1095-A (healthcare exchange, affordable care act.) In that case, TT had rounded each monthly number and added up the rounded numbers, but the state exchange added, then the IRS rounded. Technically, that error was TT's, because they are not allowed to round on the 1095-A, only on the calculations based on the 1095-a, so by adding up the numbers they did not correctly transcribe the 1095-a. 

I'm just saying that errors happen, no matter who does the work. I may even be making an error right now and not know it!

[flemming]

Form 2210 all fixed (APRIL FOOL).........passes all TurboTax error checks, but when efiling ....a quick rejection due to 2210 errors.  Everything looked good this morning with all the prefiling error checks but multiple rejections on efile.  Checking, unchecking  boxes or making data alterations, updating fixes nothing.   TT programmers  need to get back to work!!!!

[bhtn75]

Well, if TT had completely modified the 2019 Form 2210 Part IV program code your suggestion would probably have worked. But when I attempted to enter 0. in Line 18, it didn't take. TT referred back to a supporting form, Form 2210 AI Part I Line 27 column (b). I presume that this is old 2019 code that didn't get completely updated. 

To solve this problem, I guess all TT software folks would have to do is to change the code to place a "0." in Line 18(b). So maybe the next update will resolve it.

[flemming]

Final 2210 problem I had after TT updated software was with program cookies.   TT CPA  provided help

in resetting cookies internal to the software (ctrl-shift-del).  Return is now in hands of IRS.

[Chloe31]

Can you fix the form for me I don't understand

[flemming]

Don't know your specific 2210 problem but some food for thought:    1. Insure all program updates applied.

2. Delete form 2210 from return and then re-enter data on new form 2210.   3. Part II Reasons for filing--most

will likely not check boxes A and B.    4.  Double check math on any data added.   5. Delete TT software cookies

by pressing ctrl-shift-del   (it may not appear that anything happened).  6.  Run error check  7. efile

[les_rjtt]

OK... I'll try to answer how the "fix" work for me and add some helpful tips along the way.  Wish TurboTax folks were more proactive and do more 'debugging'.  Along the way, this is what I found out...

1.- Initial form 2210 fix update released early on 2/26 seemed to work at first... until almost done with all my taxes, it resulted in a nasty crash where I could not relaunch TurboTax premier 2020.

2.- I had noticed before the crash that this new version was not "cleaning" correctly any data previously entered with wrong version on the actual form2210.  I had manually removed the "ghost" data from the form 2210 and I lost "confidence" in how clean the fix was as far as catching potential errors.

3.- Because of the crash, I had to totally uninstall the version of TurboTax Premier 2020. BTW, I discover that if you run TurboTax Desktop on a mac OS over Windows, Support is "on your own" pretty much.  And some on the support side will imply you are crazy to still run a desktop version rather than do your tax over the web/inb the cloud.  _:( !! Up to you to dig and try to find out anything thanks to google search.

4.- Once I was finally successful at recovering from that nasty crash, I noticed that TT folks had pushed a new patch to their 02/26/2021 initial release.  Made me realize how useful if TurboTax was clearly advertising a link so we know what is fix, what they thought was fixed but not fully, and what is newly fixed.  Just saying because again, if it exists, you have to go digging for it.  Made me look fondly back to 15-20 years ago when TurboTax Support was so good!

5.-  I decided to restart a brand new return instead of using my initial one, so all data, especially when coming to figuring out exact tax penalty due, had no chance to have been corrupted in prior versions.

6.- I used the Interview Steps and then double-checked and also review the form 2210.  I selected "NO" for Annualized calculation but selected "YES" to figure out the tax penalty based on actual dates the tax where withheld.

== In the end, because I also selected to pay everything now rather than by TurboTax default due date calculation, this saved me some $ out of my total tax due by reducing the penalty. 

== Note that when I called for support before the fix being released, I received a lot of misleading information.  I was also told than it did not really matter to figure out the penalty and I could let the IRS do it.  Actually it DOES matter: the earlier you can pay the full balance due, the less penalty you'll have to pay.  By setting the date to fully pay, I have total control instead of the IRS.   Another area of TurboTax "expertise" where I have lost confidence.

== As far as all the discussion about BOX D being checked on the form.  The method I used will result in box D being checked.  This seems correct in my situation since I selected to figure out the penalty on the date it was withheld and not by the IRS default quarters.

== As far as Form2210 being or not being included with the e-filing, I haven't yet checked but the TOTAL DUE listed on form 1040 clearly indicate the amount for the penalty on top of amount of tax due.  TurboTax added both numbers correctly.

7.- CONCLUSION:  I have been very unhappy with TurboTax handling of their form2210 bugs and release of the final form.  POSITIVE NOTE:  TurboTax version R19.040 with TPS Forms v2020.72.0.2 released later on 2/26 seems to be working now correctly.  TIPS:  If you think your current return is not calculating things correctly still, I strongly recommend started a brand new return from scratch (even if you curse TT software for having to do this) to save any doubts.  If you experienced crashes following the 2/26/2021 updates when working on a pre-existing return, you may want to consider un-installing TurboTax and then re-installing it first + starting a brand new return.

I hope this helps others.  Again, I am no tax expert and but have been extremely frustrated with the poor handling by TurboTax of any Form2210 issues since early February and the amount of misleading info or totally useless info by the TurboTax staff. I hope this helps some of you and save you some of my troubles.

[les_rjtt]

If you go to the Form 2210 and follow the "worksheets" and "zoom"  button by the side, you should be able to see how to final penalty is calculated.  At least, it did it for me after I entered everything using the Interview Step mode first and then switched to Forms to check at the end.

[les_rjtt]

If you go to the Form 2210 and follow the "worksheets" and "zoom"  button by the side, you should be able to see how to final penalty is calculated.  At least, it did it for me after I entered everything using the Interview Step mode first and then switched to Forms to check at the end.  Note: I trusted that TurboTax had their numbers, periods, rates, etc. correct.  But you can see how they calculated your final penalty there.

[Spino]

@les_rjtt Regrettably, in the situation where there is an overpayment in the first/second quarter (merged in 2020 due to COVID relief), my TT desktop for windows, as of 3/3 morning, is NOT correctly carrying the overpayment to the third quarter, instead carrying a 0 amount. So at least in this particular case, TT is not correctly calculating the tax.
This is highly unusual, so I don't blame you for assuming the calculations and relationships between fields would all be correct, but in this particular situation (overpayment in the first quarter) if TT shows you owing an underpayment penalty, it may not be [i.e. is] calculating the amount correctly. Otherwise you should be fine. [This is all in this one thread because often people posting here are making the assumption you're making and are mystified what's wrong. Really there were two issues--the form being ready for those who need it and then the form calculating inaccurately for a small fraction of those using it. The form is now ready. The calculating problem is still there.]

[SpykeDaddy]

I can confirm, Spino, that I have the exact same issue. I called TurboTax on 2/28 and after two hours got disconnected while they were working with their backend staff. I held out hope that they would fix it by now. The more people that call and report this, the better chance it'll get fixed. I'll be calling support again this weekend if it isn't fixed over this week.

[bhtn75]

Thanks for staying on top of the calculating problem.