Mojave OS for Apple computers is required for 2020. Thousands of 2011 Apple computers will be unable to run TurboTax. Is there a way to let Intuit know of that problem?

[macuser_22]

I did not say XCode.  The official Apple support for OS 10.13 ends in January 2021 and TurboTax will not support any OS not currently supported by the OS manufacture (by current I mean the entire 2021 tax year).  I am sure that is a Intuit business decision.    It has been the policy for years and I do not think it will change anytime soon.  This question  comes up every year - last year it was OS 10.12 that was dropped and next year 10.14 will be dropped.  

Management simply does not believe there is sufficient customer base to justify maintaining software for outdated OS's. Windows desktop still dominates the US market and the old Mac market is shrinking every day.

Personally I will be in the same position next year, while I can upgrade to 10.14, it does not support 32 bit apps.    I have a 32 but app that I use all the time there there is  no replacement for it and the vendor is out of business.

[dmr0]

@macuser_22 I think both of us know there isn't much value to continuing this discussion. Intuit made a decision. I think it it is an unwise decision because it disrespects and abandons loyal customers who are stuck on an older version of macOS and can't upgrade on their current hardware. You think it is a defensible business decision to refuse to support TurboTax on an operating systems that the vendor (Apple) is no longer supporting.

I don't intend to argue (because I think it would be pointless). In the interest of accuracy, not argument, I want to respond to a few of your statements.

1. In a recent message you wrote "Is [I think that was intended to be "It"] is not business discussion". In your most recent message you wrote "I am sure that is a Intuit business decision." I suspect that your second statement is correct, so it is a business discussion.

2. In a recent message you wrote "the current Apple supplied developer tools only support OS's 10.14 and later. Any Apple application complied with the APPLE tools will not install in any earlier OS." No. While Apple only supports OS's 10.14 and later, Apple supplied developer tools can generate code for earlier deployment targets.

3. In response to my discussion of Apple development tools (specifically Xcode and SDKs), you wrote "True, but then they would not get support from Apple if problems arise since Apple no longer supports it." You seem to be responding to my comments about Xcode 12.1. In that case, I think you are mistaken because I believe that Apple still supports Xcode 12.1 (which was released on 20-Oct-2020).

4. You wrote "Also if they want to offer the latest Apple features they must use the current version of developer tools." If Intuit wants to use the latest Apple features (which were introduced in Big Sur), Intuit would either have to limit TurboTax to only running on Big Sur or would have to program around the absence of those features in earlier versions of macOS. The same statement could be made about Mojave. If Intuit wants to use the Apple features which were introduced in Mojave, Intuit would either have to limit TurboTax to only running on Mojave or later or would have to program around the absence of those features in earlier versions of macOS. I'm not aware of any features first introduced in Mojave on which TurboTax depends in a way that they couldn't program around the absence of those features. Are you aware of any? Again note that while Apple is only supporting Mojave and later, I believe that Apple is continuing to support development tools that can generate code for earlier deployment targets.

5. You wrote "TurboTax management made the decision several years ago to only use the latest Apple versions." If that were true, then TurboTax wouldn't run on anything earlier than Big Sur. You must have meant to say that Intuit management made a decision to prevent TurboTax from running on versions of macOS that wouldn't be supported by Apple through the filing year. (Note the distinction between "not support" and "prevent from running".) This is not a totally insane decision - there is some rationale for it. It is just an unwise business decision, particularly this year (due to Apple's migration to Apple silicon).

6. You wrote "I did not say XCode." But we were talking about Apple developer tools (i.e., Xcode and SDKs). I was saying that Apple continues to support developer tools that generate code for deployment targets earlier than Mojave.

7. You wrote " I will be in the same position next year, while I can upgrade to 10.14, it does not support 32 bit apps."  10.14 is Mojave, which does support 32-bit apps. I suspect you meant 10.15 (Catalina, which does not support 32-bit apps). There are various things that you could do. The easiest would be to switch from using TurboTax to use other tax software that runs on Mojave. Another simple option would be to have two boot volumes - one running Mojave for your 32-bit apps and the other running Catalina for TurboTax 2021. Another would be to run a virtual machine environment on one version of macOS and run the other version of macOS as a guest system in the virtual environment. The least likely to be successful is to try to persuade Intuit to care about customers like you, me, everybody else who has contributed to this thread, and the many, many more customers that are having the same problem but haven't participated in (may not even know about) this thread.

[DeltonaBob]

Currently, our Apple computers are at 10.13.6 and are quite functional for all our needs.

We have been using TurboTax for over 30 years on both Windows and Mac platforms.

We do have a very old Widows laptop but cannot upgrade to the later releases and is no longer being used for anything therefore virtually useless.

At the present time, awe cannot afford to purchase another computer to run TurboTax and do not want to use an online version on anything as we prefer to be in control of our own data,

Cannot TurboTax be compiled for our macOS using an older SDK so that the thousands of loyal customers can still use your product? 

If not, then you can possibly lose thousands of loyal customers to another product that can.

[dmr0]

@DeltonaBob Yes, TurboTax could be compiled for macOS 10.13.6 (High Sierra) using an older SDK so that the thousands of loyal customers could still use it. Unfortunately, Intuit decided not to do that. I think that that was an unwise decision.

Incidentally, yesterday I entered a comment in this forum addressing previous comments about running TurboTax 2020 on macOS versions earlier than Mojave. My comment was polite and respectful, but expressed disagreement with Intuit's decision. That comment is no longer visible. Does someone censor comments in this forum if they express disagreement with decisions that Intuit made? If my comment was deliberately removed, I request that it be reinstated. If it wasn't deliberately removed, then I'd like to report that there must be a bug that caused my comment to disappear.

[DoninGA]

@dmr0 These are all of your posts - https://ttlc.intuit.com/community/user/viewprofilepage/user-id/2674593

[macuser_22]

---

@dmr0 wrote:

@DeltonaBob Yes, TurboTax could be compiled for macOS 10.13.6 (High Sierra) using an older SDK so that the thousands of loyal customers could still use it. Unfortunately, Intuit decided not to do that. I think that that was an unwise decision.

The only post from your account yesterday is this one and it appears to be there:

https://ttlc.intuit.com/community/taxes/discussion/re-mojave-os-for-apple-computers-is-required-for-...

[dmr0]

@DoninGA , @macuser_22 Thank you both. I don't understand what happened. The "missing comment" was between the one from @macuser_22 starting "I did not say XCode." and the one from @DeltonaBob starting "Currently, our Apple computers are at 10.13.6".

I made it as a reply to @macuser_22's comment starting "I did not say XCode." and after clicking the "Post" button, I saw that it was posted. The only hypotheses that I have are either that I am crazy or that it was removed in a way that not only removed it from general visibility in the forum, but also removed from the list of my activity in my profile. Since I am not fond of the "I am crazy" hypothesis, I favor the "it was removed in a way that not only removed it from general visibility in the forum, but also removed from the list of my activity in my profile" hypothesis. Is it possible to contact someone who administers this forum to ask if that is possible?

[macuser_22]

There would be no reason for a moderator to remove it.    The only posts that I have ever seen removed is because of profanity and that is usually because one of us flags it as profanity..   Over the years there have been many discussions the same at this one.    I have never seen TurboTax censor a post.

[dmr0]

@macuser_22 Thank you for your response. I guess I'm stuck with the "I'm crazy" hypothesis then.

The bulk of the missing message was in response to what you had written. Most of it was nitpicking and not worth the effort of me trying to reproduce. I did comment on your issue next year when TurboTax 2021 will require a version of macOS that doesn't support 32-bit apps. I see four options (arranged from easiest to hardest):

1. Switch to a different tax package that will run on Mojave
2. Arrange to have two boot volumes so that you can boot Catalina to run TurboTax 2021 or boot Mojave to run your 32-bit apps
3. Under either Mojave or Catalina create a virtual machine environment so that you can run the other version of macOS as a guest system
4. Persuade Intuit management that their current policy drives away business and that they should change their policy to produce versions of TurboTax than can run on at least the set of macOS versions which Apple development tools (i.e., Xcode & SDKs) continue to support as deployment targets (even though Apple no longer actively supports those versions of macOS)

[SkiMeister-NC]

I'm the original poster of this question.  I will use the online version of TurboTax for 2020.  It has already uploaded my 2019 taxes  from my computer to the program, so I'm ready to go.  Not what I prefer, but it will suffice until I decide to get a new-to-me computer (I always purchased used).

[Dismayed]

I'm planning to make my Mac Pro 5,1 a dedicated Windows 10 machine - if I can make my Win 10 SSD bootable.  Apple seems to be trying to sabotage the use of perfectly good legacy hardware!  So I'll never buy another Mac.

[dmr0]

@macuser_22. @DoninGA, I'm more confused than ever. (It feels as though I'm being gaslighted.) The post which I complained had disappeared has now reappeared. As I previously mentioned, it follows the post from @macuser_22 beginning "I did not say XCode." and precedes the post from @DeltonaBob beginning "Currently, our Apple computers are at 10.13.6". My missing and now reappeared post begins "@macuser_22 I think both of us know there isn't much value".

Can anyone else confirm that they couldn't see it before, but now they can. Since I'm still not fond of the "I am crazy" hypothesis, can anyone offer another explanation?

[ACKMMH1]

This is not due to Intuit. This is merely due to Apple. It is not a change. It is due to the fact that to develop new Mac software (and TurboTax each year is a new product) the Apple development tools (supplied by Apple) must be used.  Apple only supports 3 years of OS, currently OSX 10.13, 10.14 and 10.15.   There simply is no way for a software company to develop new software for any Mac OS prior to 10.13 using the current Apple tools. It is Apple that does not support OSX 10.12 or earlier, not TurboTax. For 2019, OSX 10.13 of later is required. Next year, 2020, Apple will drop support for OSX 10.13 so 10.14 or later will be required.

I have also found on https://www.discussions.apple.com this information in regards to MAC users

Try booting into Safe Mode (How to use safe mode on your Mac - Apple Support) by booting with the Shift key held down and check there to see if the problem persists.  Reboot normally and test again. NOTE: Safe Mode boot can take up to 10 minutes as it's doing the following; 
• Verifies your startup disk and attempts to repair directory issues, if needed
• Loads only required kernel extensions (prevents 3rd party kernel/extensions from loading)
• Prevents Startup Items and Login Items from opening automatically
• Disables user-installed fonts 
• Deletes font caches, kernel cache, and other system cache files

Apple Support

How to use safe mode on your Mac

Safe mode can help you to determine whether an issue is caused by software that loads as your Mac starts up.

[dmr0]

@ACKMMH1 Since this has all been hashed out in this thread, it might be useful for you to read the posts in the thread.

In summary:

1. You are correct that Apple currently supports only 10.14 (Mojave), 10.15 (Catalina), and 11.0 (Big Sur).
2. However, according to the Apple document at https://developer.apple.com/support/xcode/ the latest version of the Apple developer tools (Xcode  and SDKs) can generate code for a deployment target running macOS versions 10.9 through 11.0 (that is, Mavericks, Yosemite, El Capitan, Sierra, High Sierra, Mojave, Catalina, and Big Sur). See the chart "Minimum requirements and supported SDKs" on the web page https://developer.apple.com/support/xcode/  In particular, see the column headed OS and the Legend below the chart for an explanation of the contents of each of the columns.

[macuser_22]

The bottom line is what  *can* be done and what is practicable and cost effective to do  are different things.  

TurboTax stated years ago that they will not support any operating system not supported by the OS manufacturer.    They also dropped Windows 7 this year for the same reason.

Apple officially drops support for 10.13 in Jan 2021, since TurboTax 2020 is for the 2021 filing season, 10.13 will not be supported during the life of TurboTax 2020.

Arguing with the messenger will not get you any results.  If you want to complain to TurboTax then:

Per TurboTax.

You can contact Intuit by mail at Consumer Tax Group, Intuit Inc., 2800 E Commerce Center Place, Tucson, AZ 85706 or by calling 888-777-3066 if you have a question or concern about any product or service we sell over the Internet.