E-file rejected due to ForeignTaxesPaidOrAccruedDt on Form 1116

[Deskandchairs]

"Various" for multiple countries is permitted, regardless of what the official IRS instructions perhaps DON'T say on the topic.  When I first started using TT, I put all of my foreign income in as from "Various" since that is what my professional tax preparer had been doing.  This year, I input that information in two categories, RIC and Various.  I successfully e-filed that way this Monday.

HOWEVER, as many others have commented, you absolutely can NOT use 'various' for the 'date paid or accrued' (part II of form1116)

[drennman]

Deskandchairs:

Just to second your post, notwithstanding some posts to the contrary, I agree that Various for countries is a perfectly valid and IRS acceptable entry.  And that Various for Date Paid or Accrued is absolutely deadly for e-filing.  (Though various is the right answer if you had tax withheld on 4 dividend payments the date isn't really 12/31/2020 but indeed various. But don't enter various for any dates.)  

Various for Country is also how it shows up on my 1099-B from Fidelity.  

I know that some people would prefer to entry country by country which is valid too.  

[Radtree]

Foxbat, 

I went back through the thread and found where you  posted a compilation of our prior postings. However, it sounds like you were able to actually efile and the IRS rejected your return. 

What Turbotax is doing now: It refuses to even let me even try to file with the IRS via efiling.  When I try to submit I get a message saying that because I am using the simplified method, they don't support efiling and that I need to mail it in.

This seems to be their "fix" to this problem. So I was thinking that the only way to proceed is to mail it in or change to nonsimplified (which, of course, I cannot do without prior IRS approval). 

But are you saying that if we tweak the entries just right, then Turbotax will allow the filing to go through?

[Foxbat]

Radtree,

Yes, it worked for me and for others.  Getting a TT block before attempting to file is something  I believe I encountered that on one of my failed attempts.  When I got the Form 1099-DIVs corrected (use the Forms method, not Step-by-step!) , along with the Form 1116 itself, the AMT reference went away.

I know it is a pain to do the detailed review I describe but so far most people who work their way through have ultimately been successful.  Be prepared for multiple fails before you get it completely debugged.

[theTA007]

All, I had trouble with my 1116 but the issue did not seem to be related to the Simplified AMT election.  After 4 or 5 iterations, trying to implement all the suggestions made in this forum (especially helpful: those by Foxbat), my return was finally accepted by the IRS last night.

[Radtree]

Foxbat,

I checked everything in your very detailed write-up. (Thanks for that--must have been a lot of work!)  The only thing missing was that I also needed to put "RIC" into the input fields of 1099-DIVS. Everything else checked out.  After this, I tried to file again. Rejected.

Then I went and compared the 2020 Form 1116 to my filed 2019 version. And just before doing this, I also noticed Goldiegirl's posts. 

This is all using the Forms view, not step-by-step. 

In my 2020 Form 1116, Part II, under the heading "1099-DIV/INT Reporting Smart Worksheet" the box for "A" ("Row A below includes foreign taxes paid or accrued on a 1099-DIV or 1099-INT") should have been checked, but it was not.  And when I look at the worksheet, everything is accurate and complete, so this appears to be a bug in Turbotax. 

When I manually check the box for "A" here, the Line A, column (l) ("Date paid or accrued") changes from 12/31/2020 (which is correct, and tracks the worksheet properly) to this text instead: "1099 taxes"!   Yes, that is not a typo (rather, not a typo by me)--Turbotax changes the date to "1099 taxes".  

And now here is the really frustrating part! Even in the "forms" view, Turbotax does not allow me to change the date from "1099 taxes" to "12/31/2020"! - This is supposed to be hard link to the date under "Country A" of Part II of the worksheet, and when I click on the little magnifying glass next to this entry it takes me to this box in the form. However, in the form, the date is just as it should be: 12/31/2020.  I have no idea where Turbotax is getting "1099 taxes" from and putting it into the date. I even saved all forms and worksheets to a pdf and did a search for that--nothing!

BTW, the same error appears on the Form 1116 AMT.  Part II, Row A, column (l) has "1099 taxes" instead of the actual date, and this links back to same box in the same worksheet that correctly has 1"2/31/2020"

I'm hoping someone who reads this might be able to provide insight into what is transpiring. So far, it looks like the Turbotax software is fatally flawed. I think this is a programmer error.

This is an obvious screw-up, but I'm not seeing anyway to fix it. 

[Deskandchairs]

Radtree

"1099 taxes" is a perfectly acceptable entry (even thought it is not technically a date).  This was pointed out as coming directly from IRS instruction in a post by "saldirj"on March 1.  See the last sentence of that post.

To be more specif, I successfully e-fled on Monday with those entries on my form 1116, both for income listed as RIC and Various.  So, trying to change "1099 taxes" is chasing the wrong issue.

Good luck

[Radtree]

Thanks, I'll take a look at that. 

I've been on a call with Turbotax customer support for the last 1 hour and 40 minutes, and the call is still continuing. They had me re-enter all the foreign tax stuff (and there is a lot). When that got us nowhere, they had me completely uninstall and reinstall Turbotax. Still no results...☹️

[Radtree]

Going back through this thread, I can't see that specific post.

But regardless, either way it won't efile for me. Not with the date filled in via the override feature, and not with "1099 taxes" filled in as the "date." The reason I was pursuing this, is that I'd gone through Foxbat's checklist and also what other people mentioned, and my the process of elimination, this was the only remaining "open issue" that gave me any hope that it could be fixed.

But well, I spent 2 hours on the phone with Intuit customer support. The representative said she was discussing with Tier 2 on this and that efiling was the only option. Said that as long as the simplified method was used that it was barred from going through efile.  Intuit doesn't allow it be efiled, and it wouldn't matter what I changed or fixed.  Just passing on what they told me. 

This is weird considering that it is clear that some people using the simplified method are able to efile. Maybe the restrictions are different for different versions of Turbotax?

[ABitAnnoyed]

I think time is part of the answer here. 

It appears from posts in other threads that TurboTax added the "we won't allow you to efile if you use Simplified AMT" hard stop around March 19th.   If you filed before that, it's entirely possible that you could have efiled, if you avoided the other 1116 gotchas that Foxbat has detailed, even if you had Simplified AMT on.   I haven't heard anyone say they've been able to efile with Simplified AMT more recently.

Seems entirely possible to me that TT's 'fix' on March 19th was unnecessary - that they misunderstood the issue and the Simplified election wasn't even really a problem at all.   But we'll never know, will we?

[olsonep]

Before mid-March, it was still not possible to e-file with the simplified form. This is because Turbo's 1116 AltMin simplified from does not fill in the date! It is blank. In 2020 this gets flagged by IRS e-file. This case is common if you earn a salary in a foreign country and trigger AMT. 

If Intuit had simply fixed the form to fill in the date from the worksheet (like it does for the 1116 AltMin non-simplified) then there would have been no trouble. They had this info in Feb. One smart developer in one day could have fixed it (with maybe a week of regression testing) Instead they choose to ignore it, piss people off, cause 1000s of hours of support costs. and eventually say you can't do it. Someone there should loose their job.

I e-filed in Feb and got my stimulus money. I figured out the correct taxes. Then I changed to non-simplifed and confirmed that in my case, the tax refund amount was 100% identical. Then I e-filed.  After tax day, I will submit an amended return with the simplified calculation with a letter explaining what I did. No change to the amounts in my case. 

[Deskandchairs]

To olsonep:  The more information collected on this site, the more confusing the issue becomes.  Or, more correctly, confusing as to what the issue even is.

Monday (May10), I successfully e-filled using TT "premier"  with a form 1116 and "1099 taxes" in the date paid/accrued box both for a RIC category of foreign income and also for a Various category of foreign income.  And I use the "simpliefied" method for the AltMin computation.  My condolences to those who changed this election in order to defeat the roadblock (which I did not encounter).

TT is not taking any credit for fixing anything (I clicked on a link within the blog thread to be informed of any updates); no communication resulted.  I have not otherwise contacted them.  But, I have to agree with you that  TT is ignoring a "known" problem and frustrating a goodly number of its customers.

As I suggested in a previous post, isn't it time to consider if we are going to use TT next year?  And, what is the better alternative??

[Radtree]

I agree. If anyone knows of any better alternative to Turbotax I am all ears.   My perception is that the quality of Turbotax has been going down over the years.  In the last several years, there has always been some glitch in the software that has caused me to needlessly waste a lot of time.

And Turbotax has always been dropping the ball when it comes to the foreign tax credit/deduction. The process for handing this by Turbotax has, in my perception, been way below par even compared to the rest of Turbotax. The way Turbotax interviews for this, and the way it processes the tax forms is, to use the words I told the Intuit customer service rep earlier today, as if it was designed by a small child. 

I think that Turbotax is probably fine for someone who has a simple situation with only W-2 income, but for many of the rest of us they are increasingly missing the mark.

Like others here, I did sign up for the updates from Intuit on this issue a while ago, and so far it's only crickets. They have lacked the courtesy to communicate anything.  They just continue to strike out.

Has anyone here tried the H&R Block software? How does it compare?

Given that the price of the software packages is insignificant compared to the amount of time we have to invest in using it, even a slight increase in quality would be worth changing.  Time is our most valuable resource, and in recent years,  Turbotax has been wasting hours of my time each year. 

[Deskandchairs]

Don't overlook ABitAnnoyed's previous response, but let' get more opinions!

ABitAnnoyed

Level 2

Monday

 

@Deskandchairs 

This is only one man's opinion, but for what it's worth I chose TaxAct over H&R Block.  I tried all three this year due to Turbotax refusing to efile (I have the Simplified AMT message).   I efiled (successfully) with TaxAct.

TaxAct is superior in my view because they show their work.   To be specific (and this may be highly specific to my tax situation), I am required to fill out the Line 18 worksheet for the AMT version of Form 1116.   Block skipped the worksheet altogether, and if I'd filed with Block I would have paid the IRS an extra $500 because of that.   TurboTax filled it out, silently and correctly, but to verify it I had to compute it by hand.   TaxAct filled it out correctly, and also provided me with the filled-out worksheet. 

More generally, TaxAct provides the most backup detail, Turbotax in the middle, and Block provides very little beyond what actually gets filed with the IRS.   That might not be important to everyone, of course.   It wouldn't have been enough to make me want to switch if it hadn't been for Turbotax refusing to efile my return.  But now I'm a happy TaxAct customer.   Bye bye, Turbotax. 

[Deskandchairs]

@Deskandchairs 

This is only one man's opinion, but for what it's worth I chose TaxAct over H&R Block.  I tried all three this year due to Turbotax refusing to efile (I have the Simplified AMT message).   I efiled (successfully) with TaxAct.

TaxAct is superior in my view because they show their work.   To be specific (and this may be highly specific to my tax situation), I am required to fill out the Line 18 worksheet for the AMT version of Form 1116.   Block skipped the worksheet altogether, and if I'd filed with Block I would have paid the IRS an extra $500 because of that.   TurboTax filled it out, silently and correctly, but to verify it I had to compute it by hand.   TaxAct filled it out correctly, and also provided me with the filled-out worksheet. 

More generally, TaxAct provides the most backup detail, Turbotax in the middle, and Block provides very little beyond what actually gets filed with the IRS.   That might not be important to everyone, of course.   It wouldn't have been enough to make me want to switch if it hadn't been for Turbotax refusing to efile my return.  But now I'm a happy TaxAct customer.   Bye bye, Turbotax. 

[Radtree]

Thank you to all the community members here who have been generous with their time and done their best to help others. That unpaid members of the public are doing more to help Turbotax customers then is Turbotax itself with this issue--that speaks volumes.