CSF 1099-R Survivor Annuity Suddenly Has Errors

[Thomas S]

One of the tax documents I have to enter is a CSF 1099-R Survivor Annuity.  Line 1 on the form is the “Gross distribution” and has an amount shown on that line.  However, Line 2a, “taxable amount”, is blank.  Since there are “Total Employee Contributions” on Line 9b, the “Simplified Method” must be used to determine how much of the “gross distribution” is taxable and how much is simply a distribution of the employee’s own contributions and, therefore, tax-free.  This calculation had worked flawlessly since this annuity began in 2002.  And it worked this year up until this last TurboTax software update on Thursday, 3/18/21.  Now TurboTax says that the entire gross distribution on Line 1 is not taxable.  This is not correct.  I tried deleting the CSF 1099-R and then reentering it but no luck.  Same wrong answer.  No matter what I seem to do, I cannot get TurboTax to calculate and apply the “Simplified Method” to this pension annuity like it used to.

Anybody else seeing this?  Is TurboTax aware that this error now exists when it didn’t before?

[macuser_22]

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@Thomas S wrote:

One of the tax documents I have to enter is a CSF 1099-R Survivor Annuity.  Line 1 on the form is the “Gross distribution” and has an amount shown on that line.  However, Line 2a, “taxable amount”, is blank.  Since there are “Total Employee Contributions” on Line 9b, the “Simplified Method” must be used to determine how much of the “gross distribution” is taxable and how much is simply a distribution of the employee’s own contributions and, therefore, tax-free.  This calculation had worked flawlessly since this annuity began in 2002.  And it worked this year up until this last TurboTax software update on Thursday, 3/18/21.  Now TurboTax says that the entire gross distribution on Line 1 is not taxable.  This is not correct.  I tried deleting the CSF 1099-R and then reentering it but no luck.  Same wrong answer.  No matter what I seem to do, I cannot get TurboTax to calculate and apply the “Simplified Method” to this pension annuity like it used to.

Anybody else seeing this?  Is TurboTax aware that this error now exists when it didn’t before?

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I do not know of any change to this interview.

[Thomas S]

Yes, I did all that.  Answered all those questions just like you indicated.  Not working now.

Remember, I said this has been working properly since 2002.  And I have been using TurboTax all those years.  When I started my 2020 return, I read in the data from my 2019 TurboTax return.  After I entered in all my 2020 tax documents (including this CSF 1099-R) everything tied out and the simplified method was being used for this annuity.  I had a $573 refund and I was just waiting for TurboTax Form 2210 Part IV to be fixed before I e-filed.  After the latest software update, my return now says I have a refund of $1,631.  And yet I didn't touch or change anything.  Just did the software update and then opened my return.  Traced the refund increase to the problem I mentioned above in this thread.

To test things, I copied my TurboTax file over to a "test" file.  Then went into the test file, deleted the CSF 1099-R and then reentered it.  No luck.  Same wrong answer.  This used to be OK.  Line 2, "taxable amount", on the form actually says "unknown" instead of being blank.  I think it says that every year.  However, when you enter the data for this form, you cannot type in "unknown" for line 2.  It's not numeric.  Also, cannot leave line 2 blank or TurboTax fills it in with whatever is on Line 1.  Must enter a 0 (zero) for line 2.  I took a quick look at my 2019 return and I had to enter a 0 for line 2 on that one also.

I really think a programming change in the last software release is causing this not to work now.  However, if you want to give you the exact details of how I entered everything I can.  Maybe you can mimic the error.

[macuser_22]

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@Thomas S wrote:

Yes, I did all that.  Answered all those questions just like you indicated.  Not working now.

Remember, I said this has been working properly since 2002.  And I have been using TurboTax all those years.  When I started my 2020 return, I read in the data from my 2019 TurboTax return.  After I entered in all my 2020 tax documents (including this CSF 1099-R) everything tied out and the simplified method was being used for this annuity.  I had a $573 refund and I was just waiting for TurboTax Form 2210 Part IV to be fixed before I e-filed.  After the latest software update, my return now says I have a refund of $1,631.  And yet I didn't touch or change anything.  Just did the software update and then opened my return.  Traced the refund increase to the problem I mentioned above in this thread.

To test things, I copied my TurboTax file over to a "test" file.  Then went into the test file, deleted the CSF 1099-R and then reentered it.  No luck.  Same wrong answer.  This used to be OK.  Line 2, "taxable amount", on the form actually says "unknown" instead of being blank.  I think it says that every year.  However, when you enter the data for this form, you cannot type in "unknown" for line 2.  It's not numeric.  Also, cannot leave line 2 blank or TurboTax fills it in with whatever is on Line 1.  Must enter a 0 (zero) for line 2.  I took a quick look at my 2019 return and I had to enter a 0 for line 2 on that one also.

I really think a programming change in the last software release is causing this not to work now.  However, if you want to give you the exact details of how I entered everything I can.  Maybe you can mimic the error.

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I see what you mean it does auto-fill box 2a with box 1, however that does not seem to matter when I enter the simplified method, the current tax is calculated and goes on the 1040 line 5b as it should.    A blank box 2a is deemed to be the same as box 1 unless it has a lower value in it.

[macuser_22]

I just tested this in the 2019 software and it behaves exactally the same for a CSF-1099-R.  It auto-fills box 2a with the box 1 amount but calculated the tax properly with the simplified method.

So this is not new.

[Thomas S]

OK, I tried what you did.  I took the zero I had input for line 2 out.  I then let TurboTax fill in line 2 with the same amount that was on line 1.  And that did work OK.  However, I used to have a zero on line 2 and that would work OK also so there was a programming change made.  And, like I said, my 2019 return has a zero on that line.

Personally, I think the programming change has made input a bit counterintuitive now.  A person unfamiliar with the simplified method may leave line 2 blank, then see it fill in with the line 1 amount as they move to the next input field and then think "I guess the taxable amount has been determined now".  Inputting a zero kind of forces the issue if you will.  But that's just my opinion.  I appreciate your assistance on this matter.

[Thomas S]

Try testing the 2019 software with inputting a zero on line 2 to see if works OK.  Then try testing the 2020 software with a zero on line 2 to see if works the same.

[macuser_22]

The same in 2019 and 2020 I see no difference.    The tax is correct on  the 1040 and that is all that matters.

[MtnTABS]

Your answer to this thread about TurboTax auto filling Box 2a not mattering because the calculation in the Simplified Method used to figure the taxable amount is what is entered on the 1040. I also must use the Simplified Method because my deceased husband used that method since 1997 and Box 9b on my CSF1099R shows the same figure as on his CSR-1099R. He died 02/24/2020 thus his 1099 covers two months and my 1099 covers 10 months. HOWEVER, when I scroll down to fill in the Simplified Method on my form, it will not let me type in the Gross Distribution in Box 1. How can I use the simplified method if I can’t fill in Box 1? TurboTax automatically carried everything over from 2019 for my husband’s Simplified Form.