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529 and distribution in lieu of scholarship. TT calcs don't seem to add up.

If I understand it, the part of a 529 earnings distribution withdrawn that is in lieu of a scholarship received by my dependent son has to be claimed as income if it isn't used for educational expenses, but there is no penalty on it.  I can't figure a way to make turbotax do this correctly.  I've entered my 1099-T and 1099-Q related to this account but the numbers don't add up.  It should be this simple:

1099-Q

Box 1: $13583

Box 2: $8006

1098-T

Box 1: $27166 (total received by college, including scholarships)

Box 6: $14000 (total scholarships received)

 

$7000 of 1099-Q Box 1's were distributed to me in lieu of scholarship

 

Amount to add to income should be:

Scholarship/Total Distribution = Scholarship ratio

Earnings attributed to scholarship = Earnings * Scholarship Ratio

7000/13583 = 0.515

Earnings Adjustment = 8006 * 0.515 = $4123

However, Turbotax only adds $2943 on line 8 schedule 1

 

It's interesting, when entering the 1099-R , Turbotax never asks me if all or part of the distribution was used to pay for tuition for my dependent.

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1 Best answer

Accepted Solutions
Hal_Al
Level 15

529 and distribution in lieu of scholarship. TT calcs don't seem to add up.

  $27,166 of qualified Tuition expenses

+   2,800 Board

-   14,000 paid by tax free scholarship 

= 15,966 of expenses are available for the 529 distribution

 

$13, 583  Parent's Box 1 1099-Q

+   7, 235 Student's Box 1 1099-Q

$20,818    Total distribution

- 15,966

= 4852   Total  Non Qualified distributions

 

You want at least ~$1500 (2200-775 +88 -19) to go on the student's return to take advantage of his lower tax rate.  After that, it should be taxed at the parent’s rate regardless of which return it’s entered on*.

 

So, for simplicity, you should not enter your 1099-Q, at all, taking the attitude it’s all covered by qualified expenses.  For your son’s return, he has 15, 966 – 13,583 = 2383 of qualified expenses and 7235 – 2383 = $4852 non-qualified distribution. 

 

How to enter, in TT,  on his return:

Enter the 1099-Q, exactly as received.

Enter the 1098-T with $16,383 (14,000 + 2383)  in box 1 and $14,000 in box 5.  The scholarship must be shown for TT to calculate the penalty exception. Enter no other numbers (board/meals was used by you).

 

Anticipated result: 4852/7235 =67% of the earnings are taxable. 0.67 x 4164  =2792 taxable income which will be entered on line 8 of Schedule 1.

 

 

*But, taxes are complicated and ideally you would try several scenarios to see which way comes out best. But that’s cumbersome in do-it-yourself software.

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22 Replies
Hal_Al
Level 15

529 and distribution in lieu of scholarship. TT calcs don't seem to add up.

@jeffschmitz 

What does  "in lieu of scholarship" mean? How did you come up with $7000?

 

Based on the numbers you stated, only a tiny portion of the 529 distribution would be taxable.  If you add in room &board, books and computers, none of it will be taxable and you should even have enough left over to claim the tuition credit.

 

 

__________________________________________________________________________________________

Qualified Tuition Plans  (QTP 529 Plans) Distributions

General Discussion

It’s complicated.

For 529 plans, there is an “owner” (usually the parent), and a “beneficiary” (usually the student dependent). The "recipient" of the distribution can be either the owner or the beneficiary depending on who the money was sent to. When the money goes directly from the Qualified Tuition Plan (QTP) to the school, the student is the "recipient". The distribution will be reported on IRS form 1099-Q. 
The 1099-Q gets reported on the recipient's return.** The recipient's name & SS# will be on the 1099-Q.
Even though the 1099-Q is going on the student's return, the 1098-T should go on the parent's return, so you can claim the education credit. You can do this because he is your dependent.

You can and should claim the tuition credit before claiming the 529 plan earnings exclusion. The educational expenses he claims for the 1099-Q should be reduced by the amount of educational expenses you claim for the credit.
But be aware, you can not double dip. You cannot count the same tuition money, for the tuition credit,  that gets him an exclusion from the taxability of the earnings (interest) on the 529 plan. Since the credit is more generous; use as much of the tuition as is needed for the credit and the rest for the interest exclusion. Another special rule allows you to claim the tuition credit even though it was "his" money that paid the tuition.
In addition, there is another rule that says the 10% penalty is waived if he was unable to cover the 529 plan withdrawal with educational expenses either because he got scholarships or the expenses were used (by him or the parents) to claim the credits. He'll have to pay tax on the earnings, at his lower tax rate (subject to the “kiddie tax”), but not the penalty.

 

Total qualified expenses (including room & board) less amounts paid by scholarship less amounts used to claim the Tuition credit equals the amount you can use to claim the earnings exclusion on the 1099-Q. 
Example:
  $10,000 in educational expenses(including room & board)

   -$3000 paid by tax free scholarship***

   -$4000 used to claim the American Opportunity credit

 =$3000 Can be used against the 1099-Q (usually on the student’s return)

 

Box 1 of the 1099-Q is $5000

Box 2 is $600

3000/5000=60% of the earnings are tax free

60%x600= $360

You have $240 of taxable income (600-360)

 

**Alternatively; you can just not report the 1099-Q, at all, if your student-beneficiary has sufficient educational expenses, including room & board (even if he lives at home) to cover the distribution. You would still have to do the math to see if there were enough expenses left over for you to claim the tuition credit. Again, you cannot double dip!  When the box 1 amount on form 1099-Q is fully covered by expenses, TurboTax will enter nothing about the 1099-Q on the actual tax forms. But, it will prepare a 1099-Q worksheet for your records, in case of an IRS inquiry.

On form 1099-Q, instructions to the recipient reads: "Nontaxable distributions from CESAs and QTPs are not required to be reported on your income tax return. You must determine the taxability of any distribution." 

***Another alternative is have the student report some of his scholarship as taxable income, to free up some expenses for the 1099-Q and/or tuition credit.

529 and distribution in lieu of scholarship. TT calcs don't seem to add up.

Probably a poor choice of words.  There is a clause in the 529 code that says if your recipient receives a scholarship, you are allowed to take a non-qualified distribution for that amount from your 529 account without paying a penalty.  You do have to pay taxes on the earnings that are part of the non-qualified portion of the distribution which is what I'm trying to figure.  

In my case, my son received 14K in scholarship money for the year, and I chose to withdraw 7K from his 529 under this clause.  Room, board, books play no part in this.  He has no fees for books, and he lives at home.  And for simplicity I really want to stick to the issue above without bringing the possibility of room/board etc. into it.  Just assume there are no costs at all for that.

 

Hal_Al
Level 15

529 and distribution in lieu of scholarship. TT calcs don't seem to add up.

Sticking to the issue:

  $27,166 of qualified expenses

-   14,000 paid by tax free scholarship 

=  !3,166 of expenses are available for the 529 distribution

13,583 - 13,166 = $417 is your "non qualified distribution". Since more than that was paid by scholarship, none of the distribution is subject to penalty.

$417 / 13,583 = 3.07% of the earning are taxable

3.07% x 8006 = $246 of taxable income to be reported on on line 8 of schedule 1

 

If TurboTax isn't giving you this result, you entered the numbers wrong. Your $7000 number is not part of the calculations.

 

A student who lives at home can still cover his "board" with 529 money. You may use the lower of actual food cost or the school's meal allowance for on campus students.

 

In addition, if otherwise eligible, you should claim the tuition credit, even if it makes more of the 529 taxable (or the student needs to declare some of his scholarship taxable). 

 

529 and distribution in lieu of scholarship. TT calcs don't seem to add up.

Thanks so much for keeping it simple, and for the extra info at the end about meal plans.  I may work that in once I have the first issue solved.  

 

Regarding the first issue, it seems in an effort to "keep things simple" I left out some cogent information.  I also had another "direct to school" distribution from my 529 that I didn't mention.  Its 1099-Q was:

Box 1: 7235

Box 2: 4164 (earnings)

 

So.. plugging these into your equation:

$27,166 of qualified expenses

-   14,000 paid by tax free scholarship 

=  !3,166 of expenses are available for the 529 distribution.  

13,583 + 7235 - 13,166 = $7652 is your "non qualified distribution". Since more than that was paid by scholarship, none of the distribution is subject to penalty. 

$7652 / 13,583 = 56.3% of the earning are taxable

56.3% x (8006 + 4164) = $6842 of taxable income to be reported on on line 8 of schedule 1

 

I had actually run those numbers before, but since neither way matched what TurboTax is telling me I figured I'd start with my simplest guess as I wasn't sure which way might be right.  Does it make sense to add the calcs from the second 1099-Q (same school, same student)?  If so, did I do the calcs right?  If so I'll have to monkey around with TT to see if I can make sense out of it.

Hal_Al
Level 15

529 and distribution in lieu of scholarship. TT calcs don't seem to add up.

Yes, you did the calcs right and yes you can and should combine the the two 1099-Qs and just make one entry in TT. (assuming the same "recipient").

 

Computers, as well as books and other course materials, are qualified expenses for the 1099-Q.

 

Don't forget the tuition credit. 

 

Having the student report  some of his scholarship as taxable is usually the smart move.  If he has no other income the first $12,400 is not taxed.  Scholarship income is treated as earned income for purpose of calculating a dependent's standard deduction, but unearned income for the "kiddie tax".

529 and distribution in lieu of scholarship. TT calcs don't seem to add up.

Thanks so much for hanging with me and for the additional information.  I did get the numbers reconciled, I had a glitch in my manual calculations above after combining, which have been updated below for posterity.  

 

The one curve in this is that while I did combine the 1099-Qs in TT,  one 1099-Q had box 6 (recipient is not the designated beneficiary) checked, and the other did not. The unchecked 1099-Q covered a direct to college payment, and the checked 1099-Q covered two different distributions,  one for the amount owed to the college, for which I sent a persona check in an equal amount to the college, and the other for $7000 of the scholarships which I kept.  Since the numbers are coming out as expected now I'm thinking I'll just keep it as is, if there's a question I have all the backup documentation.

 

Box 1: 7235

Box 2: 4164 (earnings)

 

So.. plugging these into your equation:

$27,166 of qualified expenses

-   14,000 paid by tax free scholarship 

=  !3,166 of expenses are available for the 529 distribution.  

13,583 + 7235 - 13,166 = $7652 is your "non qualified distribution". Since more than that was paid by scholarship, none of the distribution is subject to penalty. 

$7652 / (13,583 + 7235) = 36.6% of the earning are taxable

36.6% x (8006 + 4164) = $4457 of taxable income to be reported on on line 8 of schedule 1

Hal_Al
Level 15

529 and distribution in lieu of scholarship. TT calcs don't seem to add up.

You have two different "recipients".  The "recipient" of the distribution can be either the owner or the beneficiary depending on who the money was sent to. When the money goes directly from the Qualified Tuition Plan (QTP) to the school, the student is the "recipient". The distribution will be reported on IRS form 1099-Q. 
The 1099-Q gets reported on the recipient's return. The recipient's name & SS# will be on the 1099-Q.

 

You cannot combine the beneficiary  student's 1099-Q with yours.

 

You going to have to allocate expenses to both 1099-Q.  Although the student is in a lower tax bracket than you, any taxable distribution is unearned income and potentially  subject to the "kiddie tax".

529 and distribution in lieu of scholarship. TT calcs don't seem to add up.

Wow.  OK, so when I separate the 2 1099-Qs it does lower my Schedule 1 additional income to $2943.   So will I need to file taxes for him now as well since one of the 1099-Qs is in his name?  TT did let me enter it in my taxes and specify him as the recipient.  He didn't have any other income, but did have a small (<$1000) amount of capital gains.

Hal_Al
Level 15

529 and distribution in lieu of scholarship. TT calcs don't seem to add up.

Simple answer: Yes, he will have to file a tax return too.

 

But the devil's in the details: allocating the expenses to:

  1. Your 1099-Q
  2. His 1099-Q
  3. Any tuition credit
  4. Any tax free scholarships
  5. Any taxable scholarships

 

529 and distribution in lieu of scholarship. TT calcs don't seem to add up.

Yikes, my head's hurting already.  Looks like I got some research to do.  If I start a new return for him in TT will it help guide me through it?  I honestly don't care all that much about saving a few hundred dollars here and there, and my 2020 AGI is too high for tuition credit, so I value simplicity over $ at this point.

Hal_Al
Level 15

529 and distribution in lieu of scholarship. TT calcs don't seem to add up.

Provide the following info for more specific help:

  • Box 1 of the 1098-T
  • box 5 of the 1098-T
  • any scholarships not shown on the 1098-T
  • Is any of the Scholarship restricted; i.e. it must be used for tuition
  • Does box 5 include any of the 529/ESA plan payments (it should not)
  • Box 1 of the 1099-Q of your 1099-Q
  • Box 2 of the 1098-Q of your 1099-Q
  • Box 1 of the 1099-Q of his 1099-Q
  • Box 2 of the 1098-Q of his 1099-Q
  • Board cost or the schools meal allowance amount for the year
  • Other qualified expenses not included in box 1 of the 1098-T, e.g. books & computers
  • Students other income ($1000 cap gain and ???

529 and distribution in lieu of scholarship. TT calcs don't seem to add up.

Just noticed this.  Thanks again, here's the info...

  • Box 1 of the 1098-T : $27166
  • box 5 of the 1098-T: $14000
  • any scholarships not shown on the 1098-T: $0
  • Is any of the Scholarship restricted; i.e. it must be used for tuition: Yes, it all must (and was) used for tuition.  It basically just reduces the amount of tuition that has to be paid.  Tuition includes all required books and even an official iPad.
  • Does box 5 include any of the 529/ESA plan payments (it should not): no
  • Box 1 of the 1099-Q of your 1099-Q: $13, 583
  • Box 2 of the 1098-Q of your 1099-Q: $8006
  • Box 1 of the 1099-Q of his 1099-Q: $7235
  • Box 2 of the 1098-Q of his 1099-Q: $4164
  • Board cost or the schools meal allowance amount for the year: $3100 for top tier, $2800 for second tier.
  • Other qualified expenses not included in box 1 of the 1098-T, e.g. books & computers: $0
  • Students other income ($1000 cap gain and ???: 
    1099-DIV: $19
    1099-B: $775 Short term gain with $88 Wash sale loss disallowed.

529 and distribution in lieu of scholarship. TT calcs don't seem to add up.

What I don't understand is why when I add the 1099 Q to his return, it says the whole distribution amount is taxable, apparently at my tax bracket rate (kiddie tax).  Completely defeats the purpose of the 529 as not only are the earnings taxed, but the principle gets taxed again.  

Hal_Al
Level 15

529 and distribution in lieu of scholarship. TT calcs don't seem to add up.

The whole distribution amount ($7235) is NOT taxable.  What's taxable is a portion of the earnings ($4164 max). It's a matter of entering the off setting expenses.  

 

Your situation is a little more complex than others I've seen.  I'm actually working on your numbers now. I'll get back to you with specific instructions a little later. 

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