A Power of Attorney gives me authority to “prepare and sign tax returns” for my father.
The IRS says that, as my father’s POA agent, I can submit a tax return if he's “unable to sign the return due to . . . disease or injury.”
But I’m confused about exactly how to use TurboTax for this.
I searched for the answer on Google and on the TurboTax site.
I found 3 completely different answers which contradict each other.
(1) For a return submitted by e-file, some people say that if the POA gives you authority to “prepare & sign” a person’s tax returns, and the person has given you his TurboTax password and Signature PIN, you can submit the return by e-file with no additional steps. Some people say they have done this for years with no problem.
(2) For a return submitted on paper, some people say that you can sign the return like this: Sam Smith by Jane Doe POA. If IRS wants a copy of the POA, they will ask for it. Some people say they have done this for years and IRS has never asked for the POA.
(3) Some people say that to be completely correct and “official,” if you e-file a return for someone else, you must mail a paper copy of forms 2848 and 8453 to the IRS. Form 2848 is the IRS’s own version of a POA. Form 8453 is needed whenever mailing a paper document related to an e-filed return.
Of course, I would prefer to use Method (1). Is that OK to use, or is it illegal?
Is Method (2) OK to use?
Or is method (3) the only legal way to do it?
I believe that option 3 is the correct method and the one that should be used:
The instructions to the 1040 page 25 specifically address this:
If your return is signed by
a representative for you, you must have
a power of attorney attached that specifically authorizes the representative to
sign your return. To do this, you can use
Form 2848.
You would include a copy of the form 2848 if you are filing a paper version. If efiling, you would attach the form 2848 to the form 8453.
Form 8453 has a specific box to check if you are attaching a POA indicating that the individual has authority to sign the tax return:
Form 2848, Power of Attorney and Declaration of Representative (or POA that states the agent is granted authority to sign the
return)
I would also recommend when you send in the form 8453 with the POA that you send this certified mail return receipt requested. That way you know that it was received by the IRS; inexpensive insurance !!
I believe that option 3 is the correct method and the one that should be used:
The instructions to the 1040 page 25 specifically address this:
If your return is signed by
a representative for you, you must have
a power of attorney attached that specifically authorizes the representative to
sign your return. To do this, you can use
Form 2848.
You would include a copy of the form 2848 if you are filing a paper version. If efiling, you would attach the form 2848 to the form 8453.
Form 8453 has a specific box to check if you are attaching a POA indicating that the individual has authority to sign the tax return:
Form 2848, Power of Attorney and Declaration of Representative (or POA that states the agent is granted authority to sign the
return)
I would also recommend when you send in the form 8453 with the POA that you send this certified mail return receipt requested. That way you know that it was received by the IRS; inexpensive insurance !!
#1 "Some people say they have done this for years with no problem." People pass me on the freeway every day going 90MPH and get away with it - that does not make it legal (and some get caught). But you did not ask what you might be able to get away with, but what is legal.
I agree with Rick, You can e-file and then mail the 8453 with the 2848 attached within 3e days of e-fileing, or just mail file the signed return with the 2848 attached.
Rich pointed you to the IRS filing instructions, also see IRS Pub 947 page 3-4 that covers the use of form 2848 by family members who are not tax professionals.
<a rel="nofollow" target="_blank" href="https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/p947.pdf">https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/p947.pdf</a>
Many thanks for your help.
I have Form 2848 but am unsure how to fill it out.
I’ve read all the instructions but they are confusing.
I hope you can help with the following questions.
————————
LINE 1 is for my name, address, & phone.
————————
LINE 3 is for “Acts authorized.” Should I enter this?
Matter = Income
Form = 1040
Year = 2018
————————
LINE 4 says “Specific use not recorded on CAF.”
Am I right in assuming this box should NOT be checked?
————————
LINE 5a is for “Additional acts authorized.”
I assume I should check the box on Line 5a that is marked: Sign a return.
The instructions also seem to say that I should add these words to the empty area in Line 5a:
This power of attorney is being filed pursuant to 26 CFR 1.6012-1(a)(5), which requires a power of attorney to be attached to a return if a return is signed by an agent by reason of: Disease or injury.
Is this correct?
Page 8 of IRS Publication 947 says this:
A power of attorney is generally terminated if you become incapacitated or in- competent. The power of attorney can continue, however, in the case of your incapacity or incompetency if you authorize this on line 5a “Other acts authorized” of the Form 2848.
Does this mean I should also add words like these to Line 5a:
This power of attorney continues in effect in the event of my incapacity or incompetency.
————————
LINE 6 says: You must attach a copy of any power of attorney you want to remain in effect.
I want the POA to remain in effect with the IRS until he dies.
Does this mean I should attach my father's POA to 2848?
————————
If my father is too incapacitated to sign Form 2848, is it OK for me to sign as POA agent as authorized by the original POA he created?
If so, how should I sign the form? There seems to be several format that POA agents can use:
Jane Doe POA
Sam Smith by Jane Doe POA
Jane Doe POA for Sam Smith
Does the IRS require a certain format for POA signatures?
————————
If I understand correctly, after submitting Form 2848 for the first time, it will be entered on the Centralized Authorization File (CAF) system.
I will get a letter from IRS with a CAF number.
After receiving the number, I assume I must enter it on any future 2848 form.
Do I need to submit Forms 2848 and 8453 every year?
Page 9 of IRS Publication 947 seems to say that CAF numbers expire after 3 years.
But I’m not sure about this.
Recommendations as follows:
1) Complete line 1; this is your father's information
2) Do not complete line 2 since you are not eligible to practice before the IRS.
3) Complete line 3; income, 1040, 2018-2020. You are allowed prospective years but I don't recommend more than 3 years. This means you will need to complete another after 2020.
4) Line 4; check the box
5) Line 5a; check the box to sign the tax return; add the language noted in the instructions including the disease or injury as you noted; however, eliminate the last sentence noted in the instructions.
6) Line 5a other acts; I would add the language "Allow Jane Doe to perform all acts necessary to address any income tax matter related to form 1040 which includes discussing any income tax matter with the IRS for the years noted above"
7) Line 6 leave blank. This is only applicable if you already have an existing POA on file with the IRS.
😎 Sign as noted by your option 2 above; Sam Smith by Jane Doe POA. I would recommend that you also include a copy of the POA document you have; I am assuming you have a court approved POA document. Attach this as well.
9) Complete Part II using code "f" in column 1, columns 2 and 3 will be blank, sign and date
I have to be honest here, I have never seen a completed form 2848 for anyone other than an individual who could be listed in section 2.
So essentially, I provided what I believe to be accurate, but not 100% sure.
The IRS may have questions, but that is why I recommended you include your court approved POA.
Thanks for your help, Rick.
You recommend attaching copy of POA to the 2848. I can see why this is needed because otherwise IRS has no evidence that I have authority to sign the 2848 for my father.
However, this raises another issue. If I e-file the return, the 2848 must be mailed attached behind 8453. The 8453 form has is a specific list of Forms that can be attached, and I must check the box for Form 2848. However, the instructions for 8453 say:
Don't attach any form or document that isn't shown next to the checkboxes. If you are required to mail in any documentation not listed on Form 8453, you can't file the tax return electronically.
This seems to say that I can't attach the POA to the 8453 along with the 2848, and therefore I can't e-file the return. Instead, I must send a paper copy of 1040 along with the 2848 and the POA document.
Is this correct? Or am I misunderstanding something?
The check box on Form 8453 says "Form 2848 . . . or POA that states the agent is granted authority to sign the return." I take that to mean that the POA is an acceptable attachment to Form 8453. If you want to e-file, I would mail in Form 8453 with Form 2848 and the POA attached.
rjs, many thanks for your answer. I overlooked that text on the form.
One more question: do I need to mail the 2848, 8453, and POA every year?
Yes based on current provisions.
Now back to the Santa watch !!!!
Item 2 above is NOT correct. As a family member, you can practice according to page 4 of IRS publication 947.
Agree. Thanks for pointing that out. Just not what is typically seen.
Note that the processing of filing a Form 1040, a Form 2848, and a Form 8453 actually results in the three filings going to three totally different processing offices of the IRS.
I don't agree with this comment.
First, the OP will be efiling the return as noted above as they will use option #3 in their original question
Second, the court approved POA and the 2848 will be attached to the form 8453 and these will be mailed together to the mailing address noted in the instructions to the form 8453.
This is no different than any other approved attachment to the form 8453.
The OP is not sending the form 2848 in separately.
The OP isn't mail filing the 2848. The OP is e-filing a tax return and using the 8453 to transmit the 2848 to the IRS via a attachment to the 8453 "U.S. Individual Income Tax Transmittal for an IRS e-file Return". It is not a direct mail filed 2848 just cannot be e-filed so it is sent as a Transmittal instead.
As noted above, this is not a normal 2848 process.
See the instructions to the 8453.
1) many people do without issue every year ... only issue is if someone questions your authority to do so
2) if you do paper file then you sign YOUR name & put POA after it and attach a copy of the POA
3) is overkill but is a valid way to CYA
CAF number does not expire after three years. The power of attorney (Form 2848) expires after three years.
When completing the 2848 you designate what years and what forms you have the POA to sign for the individual.
This is an old thread. Dates are messed up due to bringing over from the former forum.
It appears that form 8453 is not required if you're not e-filing.
Form 8453 is the transmittal form to the IRS. You need to attach the Form 2848 to the Form 8453. You will see on the Form 8453 is the second box to check for Form 2848.
You should mail the Form 8453 with the Form 2848 attached to:
Internal Revenue Service
Attn: Shipping and Receiving, 0254
Receipt and Control Branch
Austin, TX [removed]