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New Member
posted Jun 5, 2019 3:47:48 PM

Closing proceeds /gift

0 18 2952
18 Replies
Level 15
Jun 5, 2019 3:47:49 PM

She or her trust sold the home not you or your siblings.  If the sale was taxable then her or her trust would report the sale not you.

If you have not yet consulted an elder law attorney for medicaid/medicare tax planning you really should ... there is a 5 year look back period on all gifts so this may not have been the best way to handle selling the home.

New Member
Jun 5, 2019 3:47:49 PM

deleted

Level 15
Jun 5, 2019 3:47:51 PM

By all means, consult an elder law attorney.  And do not start spending a dime of that money.  Medicaid might come after it.

New Member
Jun 5, 2019 3:47:52 PM

deleted

Level 15
Jun 5, 2019 3:47:53 PM

Earned income for income tax purposes or for medicaid purposes for you are not the same issues as the 5 year claw back for medicaid/medicare for your mom.   Seek an attorney.

Level 15
Jun 5, 2019 3:47:55 PM

I would NOT be listening to tax advice or advice about what Medicaid might do from a Social Security office employee.  Please see an attorney.

New Member
Jun 5, 2019 3:47:56 PM

deleted

Level 15
Jun 5, 2019 3:47:57 PM

You are welcome.  It can get really complicated when you are dealing with the finances of an elderly parent.  As Critter#2 pointed out, there is a five year lookback in many states if your mom ends up needing to have her nursing home care paid for by Medicaid.  They then look at EVERY record of her finances for the previous 5 years--banking records, tax returns, investments, large purchases, gifts she gave, etc.  There is a "spend down" process for assets that allows certain expenditures such as pre-paying for funeral/burial expenses, etc.  Large gifts of cash, however, could end up being disallowed, and then Medicaid could seek to recover the money your mom gave to you.  You need an attorney to look carefully at the "trust" created and see if it will be ok for you and your siblings.  Hope it all works out for you.

Level 15
Jun 5, 2019 3:47:59 PM

This is scary. There's so many different ways a trust can be set up, and just as many ways distributions from a trust can be "clawed back" by those who may legally be entitled to it.

New Member
Jun 5, 2019 3:48:00 PM

deleted

Level 15
Jun 5, 2019 3:48:01 PM

So the big problem is this: If a person gives away their property or money to make themselves "poor enough" to qualify for government help with assisted living, the government can, in some cases, go after or "claw back" those gifts.

So for example, a person needs to sell their home and go into assisted living.  The house profits of $100,000 goes into their bank account.  Their pension and social security are not enough to pay the assisted living expenses so they apply to Medicaid to cover the difference.  Medicaid says you don't qualify unless you have $3000 or less in the bank.  The person says, I'll be darned if I spend all my house profits on medical care, so I'll give away $97,000 to my family, then I will qualify for Medicaid.  In some cases, Medicaid can take those gifts back from the recipients.

Trusts can be used to safeguard assets from Medicaid, but they have to be done properly.

To your original question, any gift from your mother is not taxable income.

However, it may be subject to confiscation (partial or total) depending on the circumstances.  Your family needs the help of an attorney who works with elder law issues (if the home was in a trust, you may already have an attorney involved, who can easily explain your position to you.)

Good luck.

New Member
Jun 5, 2019 3:48:03 PM

Thank you. My mother have a long time CPA and attorney and I am just now remembering a meeting we had with all over 8 years ago and they got her covered. She is a WW2 veteran and was stationed at Los Alamo Lab in New Mexico where they made the first nuclear bomb. She is not the type to 'cheat' no matter what. When times are tough she always 'bite the bullet' and tough through it. She is all taking care of. It is I I am worrying more about because I am on social security disability and Medicaid myself. I did report to social security office immediately in person at their office and they said it is a 'gift' and to do whatever I want to do with it. It is not money that I earned or work for they said. As for Medicaid, they told me I would only need to report this annually during ReDe, not in between to report any changes in income or life changes. I just don't know how Medicaid is going to look at this on my next ReDe. I am only 54 and recently went on disability a few months. I just keep track of my spending with what I used the money for like buying a electric scooter for me, new analog hearing aids for me(born deaf), braces for my daughter, fix up my car with numerous repairs, fix up our home, donated to a few charities. and what not. My belief is they might just ask me how I spent the money. I also feel if in my guts I feel something is wrong then I need to worry. If nothing and I feel I am doing everything I should be doing and pleasing to Medicaid and social security with how I spend the money then I am okay with that. After all, why should a person be punished for receiving a gift from a parent, you know? Thank you again.

Level 15
Jun 5, 2019 3:48:04 PM

Again ... it is not your benefits or you that is being questioned.  That you recieved a gift is not the problem ... you can spend the gift anyway you want.    It is the medicaid look back rules for your mother that is the issue.  PLEASE talk to that CPA or Attorney to see what the rules are in your state.  If she is "taken care of" then maybe she has Tricare for life and will never need to apply for medicaid/medicare  to cover the nursing home costs ... talk to someone soon.

New Member
Jun 5, 2019 3:48:06 PM

Thank you. I follow you 100%. My mother do have insurance for helping her to move into assisted living and they pay for her. It is called Genworth which I think is similar to Tricare you mentioned? Medicaid does not pay for her moving and living there, Genworth does, and she had to paid first three months(deductible) and then the insurance kicked in and resume responsibility to pay for her apartment going forward. Medicaid help pay for her medical needs and RX. Her attorney and CPA did a great job making all this happen for her. Thanks. Have you heard of Genworth?

Level 15
Jun 5, 2019 3:48:07 PM

Tricare is health insurance for military members and their families.  Genworth is  long term health care coverage that pays a monthly benefit.  Sounds like you may be ok but a quick phone call to that attorney would be wise.

Level 15
Jun 5, 2019 3:48:08 PM

" She is a WW2 veteran and was stationed at Los Alamo Lab in New Mexico where they made the first nuclear bomb."
I would absolutely LOVE to sit down for a day with a camcorder and just listen to your mom talk about those days! There is no better way to learn from history, than to hear it directly from somebody who was there. As a retired AF NCO I didn't serve in "the good ole days" like you rmom and because of that have always had a keen interest in military history before my time of service.
If anything I encourage you do to this while you still can. Your children and grand children will absolutely love you for it, and will treasure such a recording of "grandma" for all time.

New Member
Jun 5, 2019 3:48:10 PM

Thank you for your kind words. I already did just what you stated for the same reason. Thank you for your service as well. I had a neighbor who was in the Air Force in WW2 and whenever he had something broken or needing repair I was there and did not charge him for helping him. He just had to pay for the materials. It was my way to say 'Thank you' to him. He was a firefighter on the airport but did not tell me where. God bless our veterans.

New Member
Jun 5, 2019 3:48:11 PM

I don't know everything that my mom have because she have professionals helping her. My mom is that kind of person to turn something away and let someone else have it if they need it more. My mom would put veterans first before herself. Nurses usually put others before themselves. Nurses who dedicated their live to veterans during WW2 are the best and they really do put veterans first before themselves. They are very protective of veterans. I think my mother have government benefits for life because my father worked for the government for 30 years. He died early and mother still receives benefits from the government under him, so I think that is why she did not opt for Tricare. Most people do not know about her background and she is modest and does not tell people what she did. There was times when I had to inform the person about her background and husband because I know she qualifies and is eligible for veteran's benefits. Thank you all again for your inputs on this matter.