Adding the value of my traditional ira increase my tax dramatically?

[marty-in-Naples]

why does adding the value of my traditional ira increase my tax dramatically? I am over 70.5 and took the rmd per my bank as required each year. It looks like the answers on the forum say that UNLESS you add the value TT miscalculates. I find the opposite!

[macuser_22]

If you have any non-deductible "basis" in the IRA that was previously reported on a 8606 form then that can lower the taxable amount.  Not entering the total value indicated that you closed the IRA so all the basis is applied to the current distribution instead of pro-rating the basis over the current distribution and the remaining IRA value.   Doing that will guarantee an IRA audit letter and a bill for the missing tax.

You can NEVER withdraw ONLY the nondeductible part - it must be prorated over the entire value of ALL Traditional IRA accounts which include SEP and SIMPLE IRA's. (For tax purposes you only have ONE Traditional IRA which can be split between as many different accounts as you want, but for tax purposes they are all added together).

For example using rough figures: if you had $60K of nondeductible contributions in an IRA with a total value of $600K (10:1 ratio), then when you take a $60K distribution from any IRA account $6,000 would be nontaxable and $54,000 would be taxable (same 10:1 ratio) , with the remaining $54K of basis staying in the IRA for future distributions. As long as there is any money in the IRA, there will be some basis.

TurboTax will ask for your non-deductible "basis" and then the *Total Value* of *all* Traditional IRA accounts as of Dec 31, 2017. That is so the prorating of the basis can be properly proportioned between the current years distribution and the remaining IRA value. That is done on the 8606 form.

[marty-in-Naples]

First, let me say that I have done this successfully in prior years. This year, for some reason, when i enter the year end value, having shown the taxable basis properly, it takes my refund to money owed. That is the ONLY change I make. ADDING the value, should show that I have money there, the RMD was taken correctly and tax withheld, so???

[macuser_22]

Of course is will.  You are not allowed to apply all of the basis if there is still an IRA in existence.  That gives artificially low taxable amounts because the required data to do the calculation was not entered.

For example assume a IRA that you took a $10,000 distribution, that had  carry over basis of $9,000 and the year end value is $75,000.

If you leave the year end value blank, (the same as zero), then the entire $9,000 basis will be applied to the $10,000 distribution and only the  $1,000 would be taxable - leaving a zero basis to carry to next year.  Doing that is not permitted.

If the $75,000 year end value is properly entered then the $9,000 basis is prorated between the $9,000 distribution and the remaining IRA value.  When that is done then 10.0588% of the $10,000 distribution ($1,059) is not taxable and $8,941 is taxable, leaving $7,941 of basis remaining  to be applied to future distributions of the remaining $75,000 in the IRA.

The difference of not entering the year end value in this example is $8,941 taxable income the correct way and $1,000 the wrong way.

If entered the wrong way the IRS will find it and bill you for the missing $7,941 of taxable income not reported plus interest and penalizes.   Plus it will mess up future distributions.